Beyond the Sale: Crafting a Purposeful Life After Your Business Exit with David Buck

Welcome to the podcast is dedicated to helping business owners to prepare for exit so you can maximise value and then exit on your terms. This is the exit insights podcast presented by succession plus I’m Darryl Bates-Brownsword. And today I’ve got a great guest. I’ve got David Buck. We’re going to discuss a topic that we haven’t talked about before on the podcast. We’ve got close. We’ve talked about getting yourself and making sure that you’re ready for exit when the business is exit ready and making sure the numbers work for you. And we’ve talked about making sure you know what you’re going to do next. But David Buck is a specialist in helping you prepare for what’s next. And especially if you’re with a partner and you’re thinking about, you once you sell your business that you will no longer be working or earning a living through your work, what are you going to be doing and how does that impact your life? So, welcome, David. Thanks for joining me today.

What an honor, Darryl. Thanks for having me.

Look, this is a good one because when we had a of a planning call, and I remember when you were talking about it, I immediately started thinking about my parents and about 35 years ago, what they were doing in the impact and when dad finished work and he retired from the army and a long military career and he was now home all the time. know, my paraphrasing here getting in mum’s way all the time and she’s getting stressed and frustrated. So is that what we’re talking about here, David?

Yes, it is the unique element of what happens when couples or partners typically, if they’re not in their business together, they usually have good, solid, independent careers on their own. And then they usually don’t retire at the same time or exit their business at the same time. So, then eventually they get shoved together, having to spend all this time that maybe they weren’t prepared for. And so it can be a difficult adjustment for many.

So, how do we prepare for that difficult adjustment? I get that some people know it’s coming and they prepare for it and put plans in place and others have got no idea that it’s coming.

And in most cases, they have no idea it’s coming. And here’s why someone who owns a business, they they either control the outcome of their time or they’re used to reacting to all the things that the business provides. So, they’re kind of like, I’m going to exit the business. I’m going to get right off into the proverbial sunset of retirement life or whatever that is. And they’re like, how hard can it be?

I’ve managed this business. I’ve been responsible for all this stuff. I just have to figure out how to manage my time. And it’s a lot harder than they think.

I can well imagine because if I think about the bulk of business owners, whether they be really entrepreneurial or just really good business owners that have managed and run and built a business over the years, they work really hard. They’re not afraid of hard work and putting in the big hours and they are very influential and used to getting things done and making things happen.

They think about and they dream about this retirement goal and they often talk about, well, I’m to get this done and then I’m going to be sitting on the drink, beach drinking, pina coladas. And when you look at that statement and you look at the person, there’s a mismatch there. There’s no real correlation because you know that after about a week sitting on the beach drinking pina coladas, they’re going to be bored and they’ll be looking for something else to do. They’ll want to get their hands involved in something.

So, some business owners realise this and come to this awareness before the deal is signed. And I’ve seen it happen where, you know, for some reason, you know, the deal doesn’t proceed. And, know, that’s just a sign that they’re just not ready. They haven’t thought about this. They haven’t planned about it because, know, it just got real. And while I’m not really ready to sit on a beach drinking pina coladas, and what will I do with my time? What the other businesses got my name on it?

You know, where’s my self worth? What? Yeah. How do I fill my days? What do I do? So David, how do you address the situation and how do you help them prepare and get ready and come up with the right plan for them?

The first element is to say what define what is your purpose in life. And so for those of us who are entrepreneurs or your own business, in many cases, it is your purpose. Your business is your purpose. And that’s great. That’s wonderful. If you derive a lot of satisfaction and value from that. But one of the things I’ve learned about hanging out and working with retirees or soon to be retirees is that nobody asks you what you do for a living when you’re around a bunch of other retirees. So, you have to figure out then and redefine what is my purpose going to be. And that’s really one of the first elements I take clients through is to say, define your ultimate purpose in life. can tie back to your work. That’s wonderful. But what that allows you to do is then bring in your personal elements and say, okay, everything I do in my personal life is that fulfilling my purpose.

And so it makes you think more broadly instead of just tying everything that derives satisfaction from the business.

So, that makes a lot of sense. Can you give me an example, a specific example of, I guess, someone you’ve worked with, of once they retired, they connected what they’re doing on a daily basis with their purpose. And yeah, I was just going to say, when the word came out of my mouth just then, retired, I just sort of realised it’s not a word we hear.

So, go ahead.

With business owners, you know, they don’t talk about retirement. They talk about what’s next, because I guess it goes back to their activeness and they don’t think about retiring. It’s just their next venture, their next project, whatever that is.

And I think that’s healthy. I actually am not a fan of the word retirement. I use it because it’s the context of what we do, because you talked about earlier, there are some stereotypes around retirement that says I get to live a resort life that I don’t know anybody who does. Life is still life. And so an example of purpose is I’ll work with someone who owns a business. And when you get right down to it, this one individual I worked with would really love to develop people.

the idea of how do I work with the team that I have to help them be better at what they do? And so we took that and I said, Okay, so you don’t want to live the day to day life of the business anymore. Is there a way you can still stay connected with the business as being a development person or a coach to the people in the business? Sometimes that doesn’t work out. The new owners want to do a hard cut. I understand that.

But we worked him into an area where then he was putting themselves in position where he could be a mentor to others. And he was seeking some paid gigs, not because he needed the money, just because, I want to derive. I got a lot of value. Great. So it can be paid or not. But we worked him into areas where he was going to be around and to be able to grow and develop people.

Yeah. So it’s a case of, and I’ve had this conversation with dad and others. It’s a case of use it or lose it is the conclusion I’ve arrived at. And I’m referring to both physical and mental. So, I see my parents and fantastic role models. They live on a property. They’re in their eighties. They’ve got a couple of acres. It’s a massive property. Yeah. They maintain it themselves mostly.

They’re getting a little bit of help now, but they maintain it themselves mostly. They’re really active. They’re dad’s chopping wood, late 80s. And I’m convinced just by being, I guess, an outside observer on his life, that because he maintains a physical and active lifestyle, he can keep maintaining a physical and active lifestyle. And mentally, it’s very similar.

He gives back. He goes. was just talking to them on the weekend and, you know, Mum says, well, Dad’s got to go to work until, you whatever. And going to work means he’s working with the RSL and he’s and for international audiences, he’s helping other returned servicemen or retired servicemen ensure that they get everything they’re entitled to in terms of retirement packages and benefits and what have you, all of all of their entitlements. And he’s working.

you know, four or five days a week. He works half days, but he leaves home by about 8, 830 most mornings. And, you know, he’s home about, you know, just after lunch, has a bit of a nap and then gets up and does some work work around the garden. So. But, you know, they’re both still sharp as a tack, so.

Is there any so so there’s my hypothesis, David, I guess. Is there any research around that? Is is there is is is to support that that that hypothesis?

Tied back to purpose, there has been multiple studies, I know, I believe one by the National Institutes of Health in the United States, that basically defining a purpose in your life does add longevity. There is this idea of knowing what you want to do. Now, what I love what your dad has done, which a lot of people struggle when they think about transitioning to the what’s next in their life is they can’t wrap around their head this idea of flexibility. So, as a business owner, everything usually a lot is poured into the business. Some business owners get it right. They’re kind of like, I’ve got a great team behind me now. I’m going on holiday for three weeks and and I’ll check in periodically. But what I try to encourage people is think about flexibility. So your dad has this time frame of where he works with others, probably termed on his time where he’s like, I’ll do this during this time frame. The receivers of those benefits, they’re going to be flexible because it’s kind of like, I get access to Darryl’s dad, so I need to make sure that needs to be around this time frame. So, this is where I try to tell people, regardless, even if you want to keep your business as you get older, derive, how can I have as flexible a lifestyle so I can pursue both personal and professional to my liking and on my timetable.

What I’m hearing David is, is doing it on your terms is the important piece here. And that’s, that’s part of purpose, isn’t it? If you, you know why you’re doing it, then you can set yourself up to be doing that and doing it on your terms that keeps you energised and it gives you purpose.

There’s there’s another stat or I don’t know if it’s an old wives tale perhaps that we hear about. Historically, you see so many people passing away, I guess, ultimately to a very short time after finishing work. And yet again, is there any research that suggests that they no longer have a purpose, they no longer have a reason to get up anymore and.

I don’t know, I’m just totally speculating here, but you there’s sort of you can’t help but to think, well, there was nothing left for them and the body just gave up.

So there is data from the, again, United States data, the Social Security Administration, that individuals who retire early and early in the United States is like 62 or younger, have actually a 2 % more chance of dying before they’re 65 than someone who waits to retire then they’re 65. Now, I have a theory behind that data and I think in a lot of cases, particularly people who own their own business, they what I call push back on their health issues. I’m not feeling well. I don’t care. I have to get up. I’ve got I’ve got a lot of things that I’ve got to do today. And so they like an athlete. They play with pain. And then what happens is they decide to say, I’m going to I’m going to retire. I’m going to leave. Well, then all of a sudden they notice the pain more.

And so they go to the doctor and then they realise, I got these medical conditions. And so I think that plays a part in it. But this is where your parents, whether intentional or not, the idea that they’re taking care of this property naturally lends itself to a structured personal care approach. They are out there, active, they’re doing things. And that’s also a challenge for people who are exit their own business when the business is just about everything because they derive their mental and physical stimulation from that business. And then when they move into an unstructured life, they don’t replace those with equally engaging either activities mentally or physically to help continue what they’ve been doing.

So, what we’re talking about is we’ve, we’ve drilled on, I guess we’ve dwelled a lot on the negative side of things and, what, what, what happens if you, if you don’t have some purpose and you don’t, you know, you don’t have a reason for, for getting up and being energised and looking after yourself physically and mentally every day. Let’s jump into some of your best tips, then down around what couples can do specifically if one of the partners are retiring and we are, can they do to support and condition and train and because it’s a brand new life really isn’t it? a big transition point.

That is correct. And it’s surprising how many couples don’t talk to each other before they head into it. Everyone’s focused on the financial elements. Obviously that’s important because you can’t do any activities in post -career life if you don’t have the finances tied to it. However, what typically happens is one person retires first.

And typically, statistically, it’s the wife. If it’s a traditional partnership, the wife is the one who retires first, typically a year or two beforehand. Now, ironically, women outlive men in the United States. Again, by five years, it can be up to six or seven years internationally around the world. so they’re retiring first. They’re actually going to live longer than their husband.

So they get into a routine of understanding retirement life sooner than the husband. Then the husband decides, boom, they go either cold turkey or they move into it. And if you look at this statistically, if you’re working 48 hours a week, and I know business owners work more than that, but let’s just use that. And then you’re fortunate enough to sleep seven hours a night.

There is 40 % of your awake time right now is structured through your career. You take that away and you have two couple, you have a couple that now are together with no work involved. They have to figure out what to do with now an additional 40 % of their life that wasn’t planned and structured together now has to be structured together. And the ones that do it well are the ones that work on it before they retire.

They play at retirement. you typically two or three years, they start to do stuff more together. They start to think about what are those key elements that we like to do together, but we also like to do alone. And they define that structure before they head off into retirement.

Okay, so and that’s where you see a lot of them, yeah, with the old golf and you need to do your thing and have some of your time and I need some of my time and, you know, whether I go to my man cave or whatever it is and you do whatever you do and, you know, that gives you energy and refills your energy source and supplies.

Correct.

What you’re saying is we need to, and I guess it’s a bit like the business owner leaving their business. They need to transition out. Yeah. And we talk about moving into a chairman style role so that you’re, you’re, you’re out of the day to day side of the business and you’re just guiding it and steering it, operating it from remote control. You’re talking from your personal life. There needs to be a similar transition of this time transitioning into, well, yeah, what’s happening or what you’ll be doing. And that could be more holidays together, depending on what the financial situation’s like, as you suggest, spending time together, understanding, you know, just rebuilding those bonds. What are some of the challenges they experienced, David?

So, typically what happens there is the idea that when I’m together, either I have to do it all together. So when I go into retirement, it’s like I got to figure out what everything I’m going to do with my my wife. Well, I think probably what you do, you have to step back is plan out a typical retirement week. Now, that’s more difficult than what you think, because that planning that typical retirement week, typically what people do is they lay out Monday, copy and paste it to every other day of the week. What I want you to do is to say, lay out Monday and then Tuesday each day individually. But you have that conversation, whether it’s around the kitchen table, together with your spouse or significant other, and you lay out to say in a typical retirement week, what do you anticipate us doing together? Or this is what I think we should do together.

And then you lay out what you want to do alone. And when you get that, when you get that set for what you think it is, that tells you how diverse my life is going to be on a weekly basis and how much time am I going to be alone or with my wife? Or even if I want to say I still want to work in some element, I’m carving out a certain amount of time for work, whether that’s tied to the business I built or helping somebody else out.

Okay, so we’ve got to map it out. And the key message that I think you keep coming back to is that we need to have those conversations with each other. We need to sit down. We need to plan it. We need to be realistic that there are going to be some changes and how do we ease into them over time and recognising that you’re going to need your space and I’m going to need my space and there’ll be some things we do separately and some things we do together. And but we need to think about it and talk about it and plan for it all.

The first question. So I had this example. I was working with a new client couple and typically I start out with, me when you think you’re going to retire. What what age do you think you retire? And the wife is was 60. And she said, I think I’m going to retire about 63, about three years. Husbands the same age as her. And I said, OK, what about you? And he said, seventy five. And the wife’s head snaps to the right and she says, hell, you’re not.

They hadn’t even discussed when either one of them was going to retire. So you think it’s kind of like long term couples. It’s like, why should we even have this conversation? You probably haven’t even discussed the basics yet.

Right. So have you got any strategies on how to start these conversations?

So I think first and foremost is for both of you to understand where you are financially. The reason why I say that is because that derives a lot of other questions. So do you both believe it? I’m not a financial adviser. I don’t I don’t give advice to people on that, but only from the standpoint is, do you believe either what you see in front of you, what your adviser is telling you, whoever you work with? Do you believe it? Because a lot of times people actually believe it on the low side. They actually underestimate their potential. So I have those discussions about what really you think those resources mean to you. And if you’ve to have a financial professional walk you through that, then do that once. Then you both are on the same page financially. Then it becomes how do we use the resources that we want to the best of our abilities? And I ask and I take clients through a robust goal planning strategy that starts with a bucket or vision list. All the exciting things you even never even thought you want to do. Then that leads from that to long term goals that then derive to annual goals that then derive to potential short term goals. You constantly fill the pipeline with goals that you’re going to do alone to together. And I think once you do that, you have an adaptive lifestyle strategy that you’re thinking more about other things than besides work.

And David, in your experience, what sort of time frame should we start be starting these conversations or thinking about them?

I ideally like to have people start them while they’re in it, while they’re in their mid fifties and…

That’s him.

And yes, in the United States, traditional retirement ages, 65 to 67, about 10 years before you start retirement. Now it doesn’t mean you’re going to plan your life out at 55, but it does mean in your fifties, you’re thinking about what does life look like post career, whether I’m going to work or not.

And then from that, I actually have had clients where they’ve built this lifestyle strategy and they’re all excited. And then I say, do you have the resources now? Well, yeah. So why are you going to wait if if you’re excited about what you’ve developed? Go make it happen. But it all derives around to what I mentioned previously, a life of flexibility, the idea that you’re defining what works right for you.

Okay, so we’ve got to plan it. We’ve got to give ourselves a good lead time. Check our financials. And if we’re excited about it, know, why delay by the sounds of things if that’s going to work for us? And when we’re thinking about this, you must come across a whole stack of misconceptions that people have got or perceptions around what life’s going to look like. What adjustments do we need to make to our thinking in general?

I think the biggest element behind that is your social network. don’t mean social media. Take that off the table. Your physical connections with others that have meaning. It drops by at least 50 percent if you choose to not work. And I would say for those of you who own your own business, that’s probably even higher because the interactions you have with either employees or staff that you have, clients, vendors or whatever, many, many people have really, really deep relationships with those people that don’t stay when they leave work. And I have my own perfect example. I started my own business. I had deep, deep corporate relationships with clients, customers, coworkers. I have only a handful of those left and it’s nobody’s fault.

But when you look at it, what’s the main connection that’s deriving you with many of your relationships is the business you own and the work that you do. So this is where I push people to say, if you’re going to head into a post -career life, take an audit of the relationships to you that are so critical that you want to have them no matter what. Then you’re to have to invest time in those relationships, even if you don’t feel you’re getting that equal time back but you’re still investing time.

Right. So we’ve got to re -evaluate or evaluate the relationships. We’ve got be planning a lot longer lead time than we thought. Don’t delay if it seems right, if we’re excited about it. We’ve covered a whole lot of points, David. Is there any key messages? Is there any one particular point or topic that you think? Business owners especially should be thinking about or that you really want them to hear from our conversation today.

It may just sound counterintuitive to what I just said, but be patient in how you’re going to adapt your strategy for what life is going to be like outside of retirement. Jim Collins in his book, to Great, talks about shoot a bullet before a cannonball. So don’t imagine this amazing life and then try to go dive in.

You have the opportunity before you head into whatever your life is beyond your business to try to figure that out. And so shoot a bullet. Do some small things. Derive a holiday and take some trips and say, do I even want to do that in retirement life? Figure out some non -profit or non -works value activity with others to see if that’s what you’d like to do. But take it slow and be patient. That’s why I like the long lead time.

So give yourself time to make the transition and slot into your new lifestyle. Brilliant. David Buck, thanks for sharing your exit insights with us today.

Darryl, it’s been an honor. Thank you so much. And I really, really appreciate it.

About David Buck

In 35+ years of business development, David Buck developed a strong awareness of what it took for people to be productive and efficient, not just busy. He also personally sought to gain a balance of having a successful career along with the ability to pursue a meaningful personal life.

That led David to start Kairos Management Solutions, and then the Infinity Lifestyle Design program, focusing all his attention to guide business professionals who struggle with a lack of flexibility in their life to gain more quality personal time. David helps his clients craft a strategy around their current management of time, and then define a lifestyle of intention, ease, and joy.

In 2024, David released his first book called, The Time Optimized Life. The book reframes the reactive nature of time management and replaces it with a proactive method of time optimization.

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